Bret Devereaux

I feel like the only modern touch that would be added would be so we can relate to these values- and I don't think many relate to the confederacy. Maybe a breakdown of our modern class structure? Although without slaves.

btw - the Sparta numbers can't be right. Confederacy was able to maintain 50% with guns 100x > fist Sparta sword 2x > fist. A fist and a stick at those ratios would overwhelm swords

I don't know the source of the data, but it could be from a biased perspective. However I imagine they kept them calm and they didn't want to rebel, not just through violence. I know about Rome, and slavery was a bit closer to a job than how the confederacy did it

(The sources for the data are in the thread, cited.) According to the sources we have, no. The Spartans routinely demeaned and degraded the helots; the universal testimony of our sources was that helotry was the worst sort of slavery in Greece.

Order was maintained by violence. The Spartans had a 'secret police' force (the krypteia) which 'vanished' troublesome helots, sometimes in considerable numbers. The helots did revolt, most notably in 464, but struggled to win against the better equipped spartiates.

I will admit I didn't read the entire 23 posts.. I was just trying to say it's perfectly viable for a historic population to control such a population. The Spartans were really insane warriors though, and apparently the history is more brutal than the pop culture, lmao

After reading, well it was very well written and entertaining. And I guess the Spartans were just.. healthy and kinda crazy, but not exceptional warriors.. the article makes me wonder though, which Greek city-state was the most successful militarily?