Bret Devereaux

So to be clear, I'm not suggesting the soldiering classes were actively malnourished, merely that they probably did not have the ultra-protein-heavy-diets that, for instance, many modern fitness nuts do. And on that basis, I think assuming pre-modern supermen is unwise.

I'm no athlete or warrior, but isn't ultra-protein needed for extreme weights & muscle building, but less so for endurance? In a sense the military things we are talking abt require some muscle and a ton of endurance. So adequate protein and calories are needed, not an overload

Sure, but we're asking if a 5th cent. Ekdromos is significantly more fit than @MykeCole . My impression is that he eats well, and is pretty physically fit (admittedly, we have never met in person). And I just don't see the difference being huge, for the reasons above.

That's not to say you can't run or fight with an aspis, of course. Just that I am guessing that the 5th cent. Ekdromos was probably almost as tired as @MykeCole . Again, my argument is not that ancient warriors were worse than moderns, just that they aren't massively better.

I should add that I'm not disputing infantry fighting with heavy loads. I mean, thureophoroi were fast-moving 'medium' infantry, and the thureos is freakin' heavy. But they pretty clearly *did* that. My guess is just that they were plenty tired afterwards.

The common thureos in the Hellenistic period is not particularly heavy at all, unless you're talking about the really big ones (as big or bigger than the Roman scutum). But most thureophoroi were handling a pretty light shield.

I did not find the thureos to be light after even five minutes of serious fighting in close. I kept having to straighten my arm and support it with my knee because it felt like my shoulder was on fire. But I’m aggressive as fuck.

What thureos were you using? But yes, aggressiveness will affect that sort of thing.