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BRIAN_____'s profile
Brian Smith
Brian Smith
Brian Smith
@BRIAN_____

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Brian Smith

@BRIAN_____

Code farmer. Security, crypto, performance, networking, usability. Rust, C++, C, Haskell, DSLs, etc. *ring*, webpki, crypto-bench, mozilla::pkix.

Honolulu & San Francisco
briansmith.org
Joined April 2008

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    1. Brian Smith‏ @BRIAN_____ Jun 8
      Replying to @hdevalence @XorNinja and

      Is this the normal way it's done? I thought it was normal to try to implement x25519 and then implement Ed25519 as a hack on top of it. If the hacky way isn't normal then it's probably less of a concern.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    2. Brian Mastenbrook‏ @bmastenbrook Jun 8
      Replying to @BRIAN_____ @hdevalence and

      How would one do that? AFAIK for signing you can't use x-only Montgomery arithmetic because encoded Ed25519 points specify a single point, not a pair of points; and for verification, you can't use a differential addition formula with Shamir's trick.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    3. thaidn‏ @XorNinja Jun 8
      Replying to @bmastenbrook @BRIAN_____ and

      +1 to what @bmastenbrook said. @BRIAN_____, people usually convert public keys from X25519 to Ed25519, to use a single key pair for both encryption and signature (I never am comfortable with this idea)

      2 replies 0 retweets 5 likes
    4. Brian Smith‏ @BRIAN_____ Jun 8
      Replying to @XorNinja @bmastenbrook and

      OK, let's jump ahead to the thing I want to verify: For these kinds of fault attacks, what is the value of checking that the result is on the curve? If the bit flipping is actually modifying the private key scalar itself then it doesn't help AFAICT, but how about otherwise?

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    5. thaidn‏ @XorNinja Jun 8
      Replying to @BRIAN_____ @bmastenbrook and

      EdDSA signing requires two scalar mults, one to compute the public key (which can be cached) and another to compute R. If adversary can cause any faults in these computations, and also learn the correct value of the public key or R, they can compute the private key

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
    6. thaidn‏ @XorNinja Jun 8
      Replying to @XorNinja @BRIAN_____ and

      Point-on-curve check can detect certain faults, but it doesn't help if the adversary can actually flip a single bit of any scalar

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    7. thaidn‏ @XorNinja Jun 8
      Replying to @XorNinja @BRIAN_____ and

      Something to think about: suppose there's a deterministic carry mispropagation bug that can be triggered with 1% of the scalar values. Is it possible to extract the private key?

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    8. thaidn‏ @XorNinja Jun 8
      Replying to @XorNinja @BRIAN_____ and

      Point-on-curve check can detect mispropagation bugs, but I'm not sure whether these bugs leak the Ed25519 private key. Since the bugs are deterministic, the adversary cannot obtain two different R values for the same nonce and message. @jurajsomorovsky thoughts?

      3 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    9. juraj somorovsky‏ @jurajsomorovsky Jun 9
      Replying to @XorNinja @BRIAN_____ and

      I think you are true, you cannot exploit deterministic bugs. You always need two signatures, one has to be computed correctly and one with a fault injection in one of the parameters.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    10. juraj somorovsky‏ @jurajsomorovsky Jun 9
      Replying to @jurajsomorovsky @XorNinja and

      The only attack scenario that I could think of is if you would have a set of servers sharing the same key. One of the servers would have this deterministic computation problem. Then you could obtain valid and invalid signatures by querying both servers.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      Brian Smith‏ @BRIAN_____ Jun 9
      Replying to @jurajsomorovsky @XorNinja and

      Imagine socket-based application. It generates a signature sig of length n and calls send(&sig[0..n])s; send() returns s < n. When the socket is writable again, it generates the same signature and does send(&sig[s..n]). Only works if signature generation is deterministic.

      3:28 AM - 9 Jun 2018
      0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes

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