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ok i genuinely don't get eugenics stigma - isn't "don't let siblings marry" or "abort a fetus if tests positive for a horrible genetic disease" eugenics? which most ppl seem to support? Am I misunderstanding what people mean by eugenics? Is there a diff word I should use?

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I think people often see eugenics as synonymous with preventing certain groups from reproducing, which seems fairly clearly bad.

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Aella

@Aella_Girl

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@SamMaxis13

but we're okay with this with certain groups, like siblings or people with significant mental illness!

5:51 AM · Dec 8, 2022

bongbong marcos, culinarist

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Eugenics isn't used in the context of incest though?

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Now that I think of it, I'm probably the strange one in that case. My understanding is that children of siblings have a rate of defect of 5%, compared to the usual 3%, which to me does not seem sufficient grounds to ban having children, although perhaps it should be discouraged.

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A LOT of people aren't ok with this for people with mental illness. And siblings are a case of “please dont reproduce with these (n<10) people.” Everybody individually still gets to reproduce, so it doesn't fall under “may be used to eradicate a certain genotype”.

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We are only “OK” with restricting those rights in the strictest sense. Buck v Bell was pretty controversial even at the time, and today is considered by many as one of the grand historic errors of jurisprudence

en.m.wikipedia.org

Buck v. Bell - Wikipedia

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Motivation matters. "Prevent mentally disabled from reproducing so they don't pass on their genes." is eugenics. "Prevent mentally disabled people from reproducing because they are unable to take care of a child" is not. IMO

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Yeah. There was this whole voluntary positive eugenics movement where the idea was to find high-quality partner to have plenty of kids with. - classy and good. These days open eug-talk i hear "got issues, will skip kids, not passing on these genes", while usually being mid-fine.

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Pretty drastic difference between the two. Like arguing the difference between eating food is good!; And eating food including cannibalism is good too! Loo ol

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We put a stop to forced sterilization. Theres an important moral distinction between restrictions that incidentally prevent reproduction, and forcible interventions aimed directly at shaping the next generation's traits. We know the latter is a slippery slope.

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“Siblings” describes a pairing, not a group of people who we categorically don’t let reproduce. The latter is a much more inherently suspect kind of restriction. I am not necessarily okay with saying “you’re too mentally ill (or otherwise disabled) to reproduce.”

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No… please separate incest taboo from eugenics. Incest taboo comes from evolution, because it’s actually bad for your offspring if there are less-related sexual partners available. And no we’re not “okay” with preventing reproduction by people with “significant mental illness”