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I have a friend who's been meditating 2-3 hours a day for a few years now, and has somehow managed to never run into normal meditation knowledge at all. He'd never heard of Jhanas before! So I read him descriptions of the Jhanas to see he'd encountered them independently 1/

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He related to some of the descriptions, but inconsistently. like first and second jhana he was like ??? never felt that, but I read third jhana and he was like oh yeah that sounds very familiar. overall he didn't find them to be much of a pattern match

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Not sure what this means, but it updates me slightly in the direction of "ppl who experience jhanas are doing so because they've been previously primed by hearing ppl describe jhanas'

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I'm not sure I personally count cause I did most of my own meditation while on psychedelics, but I have spent very many hours in bizarre states, most of them before hearing about jhanas, and I also do not find the jhanas to be a natural description of anything I've experienced.

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tho mebbe u gotta do very specific jhana meditation to experience them, and it's not just something that happens to anyone who stares at their own mind enough?

2:26 AM · Nov 11, 2022

Replying to

er to clarify: I was under the impression jhanas are supposed to be a progression, but he claimed to have experienced something that the third jhana description sounded like, but not the first two; maybe he did independently discover them, but not in order?

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Natural General Intelligence

Replying to

Nobody gets to test this for much more than a few thousand to a few tens of thousands of hours. And then, it’s incredibly hard to track or compare any of those people’s experiences. So, really hard to know how any of this could in principle work.

bananamelter (shred era)

Replying to

it seems like this is the case--there are many ways of accessing jhana, enough that someone could run into them by accident, but not enough that everyone will encounter them in a specific order!

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