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Conversation

ok I think the thing about genderpeople that *actually* bothers me is that I feel not allowed to use my own gender framework around them. I honestly don't give a shit how they present, how deviant from gender norms they are, whether they wear makeup or a boy cut. (1/6)

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The last few guys I dated would regularly wear women's clothing and I didn't mind at all. I've applied makeup to many of my male friends! Despite how I look, I'm also pretty deviant, and deeply sympathize with the difficulty of failing to perform the 'correct' gender norms. (2/6)

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So to reiterate - any expression you want to have with your own body, clothing, mannerism, vocabulary - I welcome it. But I want to retain ownership over the way gender resonates with me. To me, all that stuff above has very little to do with gender. (3/6)

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To me, expression is independent of gender, and your gender is completely outside of your control; it resides in the eyes of society. Gender *is* an assignment of society. And so when people expect me to view them as a gender I don't view them as, that just does not work.(4/6)

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I can't view them as the gender they want no matter how hard I try. And to be clear, I still use preferred pronouns and try to do all the least upsetting things for genderpeople. I just am bothered by how afraid I feel to express the way I experience gender. (5/6)

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In my ideal world, they would say "Hey, my pronouns are they/them", and then I'd say "Nice to meet you! I process your gender as your birth sex and don't view you as nonbinary personally, but I'm happy to use your pronouns if that makes you more comfortable." (6/6)

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@celine_dionysus

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what could we do to encourage being viewed as nonbinary, personally? not to start anything! looking for advice, lol

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@celine_dionysus

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@DionysusCeline

I don't know 'how' to view you as nonbinary. I think I've only once actually intuitively processed someone as "neither gender" before, and they were a trans woman on estrogen.

5:47 PM · Mar 17, 2020

@celine_dionysus

Replying to

i see yeah! would you say you socially treat people differently, based on your processing of how their gender seems?

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@celine_dionysus

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@DionysusCeline

In general... yes, a little bit? If I'm bleeding at the wrong time it affects who I ask for a tampon. It also informs me the likelihood of danger of being assaulted and also if they're talking with me because they're trying to have sex with me. Most of the time tho, no effect.

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@DionysusCeline

Then instead you should probably say "Nice to meet you! I don't understand the concept of nonbinary, but I'm willing to learn and happy to use your pronouns if that makes you more comfortable."